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  • Turbo Guide - (www.ctfsg.com)

    This was taken by wolfe. Thanks to him we all now have a guide to look forward to. This lists all the turbos the SG guys have used and have gained these power figures. Note all cars that pulled this turbos and power numbers are running stock internals, stock clutch, stock gearbox but the ones aiming for higher then 220BHP have larger injectors. Possible to make this a sticky Ryan~ Thnx

    STOCK TF035
    Requirements: Stock Setup
    Suitabillity: MT/CVT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 1600-2200 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 2800-3200RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 3800-4000RPM
    Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
    Max BHP: 240-245

    IHI RHF5
    Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
    Suitabillity: MT/CVT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 1800-2600 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3200-4200RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 4800-5000RPM
    Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
    Max BHP: 230-250

    WRX TD04L
    Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
    Suitabillity: MT/CVT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 2000-2800 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3400-4400 RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 5000-5200 RPM
    Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
    Max BHP: 270-280

    IHI VF35
    Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
    Suitabillity: MT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3200-3500 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4400-4700RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
    Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
    Max BHP: 290-350

    IHI VF28
    Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
    Suitabillity: MT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3500-3800 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4800-5000RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
    Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
    Max BHP: 290-350

    GARRETT GT2860RS
    Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/HV Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/HV Downpipe
    Suitabillity: MT
    Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3000-3400 RPM
    Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4300-4700RPM
    Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
    Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
    Max BHP: 310-370

  • #2
    Quote from Wolfe

    "As some of you might know, a few of us who are very close to the 300BHP mark have ran into complications due to the ECU's need to maintain control with regards to its pre-programmed safety procedures. We have never been able to determine why the ECU chose to behave this way and hence could only blindly come up with solutions that we think might solve the problems.

    Yesterday, we think we've made the big breakthrough. Before I begin and on behalf of the entire CTF community, I would like to thank the following people for their efforts and leg work which allow us to finally come to this stage in our quest for solutions:

    1) Koren - Continuous effort, research and update
    2) pinky & doggies11 - Running up and down with me to do this and that
    3) Tony and entire staff of DKC - For assistance in R&D and not talk money like some other workshops would
    4) Joey of Harmony - Assistance in research and fine-tuning
    5) we1hu1 - Research and Advice

    Problems
    According to joint research by workshops and us, we have came to the conclusion that the likely causes of fuel cut or power clamp boils down to either:
    1) Safety Map inside modern day ECUs which will cut power and auto-richen fuel when injector duty cycle rate hit 85%
    2) MAF sensor detecting airflow rate and sending a voltage reading to ECU and when the ECU reads and finds out that the increased reading due to turbo and power upgrades have exceeded its pre-programmed readings, it activates power cut and auto-richens fuel to compensate for this abnormality.

    Getting rid of these safety function can only be done by removing our ECU and going fully standalone. However, this is not possible as to do that, we need to remove our e-throttle and go for cable throttle. There are ECUs out there capable of controlling e-throttles but again, these ECUs are not able to be installed on our rides for the time being.

    What we can do now is thus to find solutions to go about these ECU safety functions and we came up with 2.

    Solutions
    1) Upgrade of injectors: Our stock injectors are 305cc and according to DKC's calculations, these injectors are good for about 180WHP. Anything above that would be putting a lot of stress on the injectors. There are different formulas of converting WHP to BHP but to play safe, I would say 180WHP is roughly equivalent to about 212BHP. Most of our cars are dyno-ed at Thiam Seng (which has been labelled as happy dyno by lots of performance workshops around Singapore) so we have been advised that for dynos done @ Thiam Seng, minus off about 20-30bhp and you will get your aga aga accurate BHP figures.

    Back to injectors then. For my current application, my duty cycle is currently @ 85% with stock injectors and this figure would flucuate by about +/- 5-8 (rough estimation by workshops) when you are running different gear and rpm zone or other add-ons like sideplants. ECU would task cut your power to prevent the engine running too lean should your injectors fail.

    The solution is therefore to change to bigger cc injectors (some of us went for WRX injectors while others took the EVO ones) to reduce the duty cycle and go around this problem.

    CONS: However, please do note that some cars would not start if you change injectors. Our advice would be to have a fuel regulator installed and once after injector change, to set your fuel pressure to the minimum (3). Your car should be able to start and tuning is to be done immediately. For those doing with Harmony, it is estimated by Joey he needs about 3-5 hours to fine tune the injectors on road and this should cost about $300-$500. A further dyno-tune is to follow and this should take about 2 hours (another $560 or thereabout). With all this done, your car would now be running lower duty cycle and back to its original optimized AFR condition. Total cost would therefore be:

    - Fuel Injectors: $100-$300
    - Worksmanship: $100 or thereabout
    - Fuel Regulator (Sard): $250 or thereabout
    - Fuel Regulator Gauges (if you do not have a Fuel Press gauge already) : $60 or thereabout
    - Injectors Fine Tune: $500-$1000

    2) To further ensure your MAF sensor would not bring about your downfall, please read Koren's proposed solution which has been confirmed by Harmony and DKC that it is reliable and safe. Do note though that if you are on stock turbo, this is not recomended as it is likely to CEL your car non-stop due to incorrect MAF sensor readings.

    Another solution to curb the fuel cut problem is to enlarge the MAF adaptor:

    http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f3...MAFadaptor.jpg

    The MAF sensor works by calculating the amount of air that passes through the sensor with reference to the cross sectional area.
    So for the above example, the ECU should recognise 36% less air than stock[(2*pi*2^2) /(2*pi*2.5^2)*100%], therefore allowing 36% increase in airflow..

    but take note, the internal diameter of the original MAF adaptor is only 1.++ inch.. a slight variance will cause quite a lot of changes to the reading.. i'd say go 2.5inch MAX for the upsized MAF adaptor.

    The readings after the mod should be like this..

    http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f3...85/BoreMAF.jpg

    The increase in limit is proportionate to the increase in diameter of the adaptor.

    With the above 2 solutions done, our car should be able to run bigger turbos @ higher boost (1.2-1.4 depending on your choice of turbo) without problems. Hope these help."

    Comment


    • #3
      One thing everyone should keep in mind is, our Aus spec RColt might not benefit from the turbo upgrades as we have yet to crack the ECU.

      Without a proper tuning, the drivibility might be affected.

      But this info will be good when we finally crack the ecu.

      Comment


      • #4
        Ommeh...

        like to clarify your statements

        As we found out, its a good guide that once the CVR crosses into the 300bhp mark, its better to strengthen your engine internals like forged pistons and conrod...so far, a couple of our CVRs beyond 300 bhp have fitted with Crower and Wiseco conrods and pistons (customised from US)..This is in view of the prevention to engine blowing...Furthermore, big turbos like GTs and VF series can be fully harnessed with their full potential, i.e. reaching up to 350bhp...

        For some like myself using td04l, we could reach as high as 300bhp with headers, 2.5 inch turbo back,injectors, pumps...but stil running stock engine internals...

        Another thing like to comment..our torque increment can be mind blowing...average readings we have here is about 380Nm with turbo swap...

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks for sharing that

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ColtVerR View Post
            Ommeh...

            Another thing like to comment..our torque increment can be mind blowing...average readings we have here is about 380Nm with turbo swap...
            holy poopers batman!!!! just imagine if we get our colts to this kind of level once this damn ecu is cracked... hmmmmmmmm if only i could figure out a way to convince the wife that the colt is a good family car, then i wouldn't have to sell mine!! grrrrrrrrrrr

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ommeh View Post
              Getting rid of these safety function can only be done by removing our ECU and going fully standalone. However, this is not possible as to do that, we need to remove our e-throttle and go for cable throttle. There are ECUs out there capable of controlling e-throttles but again, these ECUs are not able to be installed on our rides for the time being.
              ARGGGHHH!!!!

              Comment


              • #8
                hmmm..now im gettg more and more interested into having a turbo swap...=D

                Comment


                • #9
                  why not clamp the maf sensor?
                  to 4v

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I want a TD04L now lol!

                    280HP would be very very nice for me

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ommeh View Post
                      I want a TD04L now lol!

                      280HP would be very very nice for me
                      Go to Rexnet, Hubert once found me a good condition TD04L for aroun $100. But then without doing any ECU modding, i doubt the bigger turbo will do you much good.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        how about T28? from the nissan slivia S15?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Frogman View Post
                          ARGGGHHH!!!!
                          Dont worry bro..
                          once your ecus can be cracked, this would not be an issue...well in the region of 300 bhp that is...
                          Get the injectors, fuel regulator, pump and you should be set for turbo upgrades, => more AIR intake..

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by GM Grey View Post
                            Go to Rexnet, Hubert once found me a good condition TD04L for aroun $100. But then without doing any ECU modding, i doubt the bigger turbo will do you much good.
                            haha..keep 1st..until your ecu get cracked...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by bunnybash View Post
                              holy poopers batman!!!! just imagine if we get our colts to this kind of level once this damn ecu is cracked... hmmmmmmmm if only i could figure out a way to convince the wife that the colt is a good family car, then i wouldn't have to sell mine!! grrrrrrrrrrr
                              have you sold already?!?!

                              My torque was rated 377Nm on dyno running on td04L with high boost 1.25b ...

                              Comment

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