Turbo for COLT Version R

[CEO-Version R]

Hi guys,

Nice meeting you ppl here. I recently made a booking for the Colt Version R through a parallel importer in Singapore. Shipment is currently on its way... hopefully can get my hands on the baby in another month's time.

Btw, before i get to explore the engine bay, does any owner here have any idea of what turbo the car is using? a TD35? Like those used in the Subaru Forester?

Anyone here has the intention of upgrading to a bigger turbo like T25 / T28 (Ball Bearing Turbos) or a TD 04 / 05??

Thnks ppl! Cheers...

[Pete]

what ever it is its small. was looking at it a few days back, looks a fair bit smaller than a T25, but could be wrong

[lovecolt]

Pete's right. Its definitely smaller than a T25/T28. I tried to have a look yestersday, but can't see anything. Hopefully this information will surface in some article soon.

But what i might do, is ask our cousins in Euro, the CZT Colt people. Their CZT is pretty similar to our Version R.

[lovecolt]

According to our cousins in euro, they said its a Mitsubishi Turbo T18 on it. Don't know how true is it.....

[CEO-Version R]

Hmmm... In this case, i suppose a T25 or T28 upgrade will be most appropriate yar? Or has anyone tried up-boosting the stock turbo? How's the result?

[geebung]

Chattin with salesman when I went for a test drive and he informed me that the turbo was a mitsubishi item manufactured by the trucks division

[CEO-Version R]

Wow!! Then it must be able to take up at least a 1.5 boost! muahahaha!!

[lovecolt]

No wonder our RColt sounds abit like a 1 tonne van when it starts up :P

[Toker]

if ur brave you can pull off on of the pipes going into the waste gate at the front, this should give your turbo full boost..

one of our members tried it an i think he said it was 1.5bar

[lovecolt]

If our turbo can actually reach 1.5 bar, i'm impressed. My previous nissan 200sx's T28 only do 1.1 bar max.

[Duke]

1.5 bar is a possible pressure but everything is depending on the engine rpm and setting.

If you are reving like 6000 that means the intake valves will open up thousands of times/min and let the air inside the engine many times.

That is like making a hole under the bottle which is being filled up at the same time.

If you draw your finger back from the hole as many times as you can in a short while. The water coming in won't be enough to fill the lost water in the bottle .

Which is like a pressure loss because of a turbo insufficient.

If you have a bigger siz turbo , even if you never put your finger on the hole, the water flowing in will be enough to keep the level.

The second thing is the intake component modifications like (larger valves, more cam intake duration, bigger displacement etc...) will demand more from the turbo.

So 1.5 bar may be there at 3000 rpm but at 6000 rpm ,it is really pushing the turbo too much , it possibly won't be able to keep the manifold filled up at that demanding situation with the stock turbo.
:cool:

[CEO-Version R]

Yo Bro... Thks for the expert advise man... Anyway, i had no intention of up-boosting the stock turbo, but rather to source for an appropriate ball bearing turbo that is slightly bigger than the stock. Was juz thinking if there is anyone in the forum who has done the mod, so that i can do some homework... :)

[Duke]

Yo Bro... Thks for the expert advise man... Anyway, i had no intention of up-boosting the stock turbo, but rather to source for an appropriate ball bearing turbo that is slightly bigger than the stock. Was juz thinking if there is anyone in the forum who has done the mod, so that i can do some homework... :)

Hi CEO,

What you say is a very good idea , but notice that there is still potential with your existing turbo. Mine is 212 hp...
If you want to go further with larger turbo, what you will need is a new set of injectors, fuel pump, fuel regulator for feeding the extra air coming in. For efficiency definitely a bigger intercooler too..

On the other hand, if you say that you put a bigger turbo and keep the boost low enough for using existing fuel equipment then you will be in the stock turbo limits which is a waste of money for new turbo and a huge turbo lag to gain.
;)

[lovecolt]

interesting explanation Duke! You are right about how we should get to the potential limit of our stock turbo before even thinking about upgrading.

To me, the biggest problem with our system, is the little intercooler. We have a thread on how the boost will drop off after mid range (http://www.rcolt.com/showthread.php?t=80) Correct me if i'm wrong, but i think the reason for the drop of boost is due to smallish intercooler that is unable to provide or store enough cooled compressed air to let the boost flow last till 6500 rpm.

Hence, no matter if you upper the boost on stock turbo or upgraded to a bigger turbo, the basic issue is still there where we don't have a good top end power band.

[Duke]

interesting explanation Duke! You are right about how we should get to the potential limit of our stock turbo before even thinking about upgrading.

To me, the biggest problem with our system, is the little intercooler. We have a thread on how the boost will drop off after mid range (http://www.rcolt.com/showthread.php?t=80) Correct me if i'm wrong, but i think the reason for the drop of boost is due to smallish intercooler that is unable to provide or store enough cooled compressed air to let the boost flow last till 6500 rpm.

Hence, no matter if you upper the boost on stock turbo or upgraded to a bigger turbo, the basic issue is still there where we don't have a good top end power band.


Lovecolt,
The boost problem is not connected with intercooler, the ecu will let the turbo, pump the air until intake manifold reaches exactly the boost it's programmed for.
Even the air is hot or cold... Intercooler will just change the efficiency of a single unit of air coming in, meaning more power but not the amount of air (just the ratio of O2 in a single unit of air).

Actually the main reason for the boost loss is the MIVEC.
The ecu is programmed in that way. After letting for some boost at 3500-4500 band, the mivec system comes in which lets the engine breath more air in a single rotation (because of longer intake valve duration) . For safety reasons the ECU controls the wastegate to keep the intake manifold pressure low to protect the engine.:)

That's the reason why people can't put boost controller devices easily on our vehicles. The ECU won't let the boost get too high after 4000+ rpm and you will have engine fault lamp on.

But should be happy Lovecolt, Mivec lets the engine get nearly the same amount of air and keeps the power at a certain level for more than nearly 5500-6500 band.

Turbo still spins the same amount but the high air demand of mivec always lowers the pressure in the manifold like a hole in the bathtub:) .

The only thing that the ECU does is, not letting the turbo spin more to keep the same pressure at that conditions and letting it down to 0,5 bar...

Result is... Mivec goes in, turbo comes out :D

[lovecolt]

Sounds reasonable, Duke. But when MIVEC comes in, the car seriously don't feel as fast as when the boost is on. Power output seems linear after MIVEC comes in, instead of the sky rocket style of boost.

So, i guess the real way out, is to do ECU tuning then??

[Duke]

The thing making you feel the speed is the change in torque at a certain time period. I mean if you are at a rpm range , that has the maximum torque CHANGE!!, you like it.

After 4500, the torque starts to go down (power is rising at the same time) and acceleration feeling dies.

But this is the same for most of the turbo cars. Gear ratios are high to use the power band better and without torque the band is like zombie.

Max. torque rising range is the feeling range, after that, you just see the speed going up but no feeling rising :)

However if you buy a honda civic Vtec (160 hp/7700 rpm)+(153 nm / 7000 rpm) atmospheric, you get the feeling after 5500 rpm where the torque and power comes in. But it is like dead fish at low range.



For keeping the boost up ...

You have 2 ways,

1) Reprogram the ECU
2) Trick the ecu by the kit produced by Italian (Bonalume) - The boost still gets lower but to 0.7 bar at 6500 rpm

But never look for a real feeling after 5300 rpm!! Torque is at 3000-4000 rising...

[CEO-Version R]

Juz spoke to my tuner... he says that he will have to withdraw the mapping from my ecu in order to up-boost the stock turbo...

Duke,

U mean u dynoed ur ride and the result was 212bhp? Care to share with us ur mods to achieve that?

[Duke]

It is a dyno result.

I have bonalume kit on my car (Italian company) , removed exhaust cats.

It is really flying now :)

[liou]

Just look here http://www.bonalume.com/index.html
Its the only kit that can be trusted. Realy good results.:)

[All-hope-is-gone]

hey guys i know this is an old thread but this duke guy says he achieved 212 hp (like a 160kws or so) from removings cats.. whta the go here.. is this figure really achieveable?

[ommeh]

I had a thread up about what our stock internals and stock turbo with a good tune can achieve~

It was about 150kw at the wheel.

TF035 is a good turbo :)

[Julz]

didn't even know this thread was here.

mate, de-catting is illegal

besides that and to answer the question.. no. decatting won't get you 212hp.

it will get you CEL's on your dash though (if you like pretty lights).

is the figure achieveable.. well, i guess so. exhaust/air filter/fmic/boost controller/clutch/ecu remap might do it.. but nobody in AU really knows yet.

212hp would be a dead set **** to drive in 1st gear in a FWD

mazda 3 mps is ~190kw front wheel drive... but has an LSD i think

[Macca]

it has some electronic diff like a pogo

[Nic85]

mazda 3 mps is ~190kw front wheel drive... but has an LSD i think

Mazda 3 MPS has a mechanical diff now, it used to have an electronic diff. It still limits boost and torque in the first 2 gears to try and reduce wheel spin and torque steer.

[Patrick]

I had a thread up about what our stock internals and stock turbo with a good tune can achieve~

It was about 150kw at the wheel.

TF035 is a good turbo :)

Hi!

My name is Patrick and I tried searching for your post about 150 kW at the wheels but I can't find it. Do you remember what was done to get this figure?

I am currently (started at the beginning of June and still not done) trying to remap my Smart 44 Brabus and anything more than 180 hp (132 kW) at the wheels seems like a dream figure (or takes hardware mods). The stock figure for the Brabus is just under 150 hp (110 kW) at the wheels.

The map that we are working on right now is a combination of Colt CZT cam timing and Brabus based maps for ignition and boost. Keeping the Brabuses cam timing was sadly not possible as we got pinging as soon as we got above 1 bar above 5000 rpm. The pinging would always come at the same rev, approx. 5500 rpm.

The difference between CZT and Brabus maps in stock form is huge, much bigger than I would have imagined. I have tried both stock maps in my car.

However, thanks to Brabus being so skilled at their job the Brabus map is almost impossible to tune. Brabus have really worked hard at making the CZT engine excellent and managed to make at least 99.9 per cent of the customers pleased. I am part of the .1 that wants more though.

Anyhow, I would love to know what we are doing wrong in not being able to get more power? I would love to be looking and working for 150 rather than just 130 kW.

Thanks,
Patrick

[Patrick]

I think you just answered your own question mate 'hardware mods'... but we here in AU haven't seen any colt around 150kw yet.

132kw at the wheels sounds exactly like what we will be dealing with once an ECU remap is available with supporting mods like air filter, intercooler, exhaust & boost control.

Aha, I thought we were doing something wrong.

The remaps that I have seen of the Brabus so far have all been between 150 and 160 hp at the wheels. That these are then sold as "205" or "207" flywheel hp is a different story. With the Brabus cam timing we were also looking at max 160 wheel hp (117 kW).

It is really sad that noone seems to be able to tune and keep the Brabus cam timing, it really is so much better (fast and free reving) than the Colt timing.

Cheers,
Patrick

[ommeh]

STOCK TF035
Requirements: Stock Setup
Suitabillity: MT/CVT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 1600-2200 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 2800-3200RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 3800-4000RPM
Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
Max BHP: 240-245

this power is done from a tune from a unichip. No engine internals are changed. Bolt on part to expect for this would be fmic and a better intake. Def must have tubo back exhaust also. These are estimate figures but yer ones to aim for thats for sure

[All-hope-is-gone]

that would be awesome..

[Patrick]

this power is done from a tune from a unichip. No engine internals are changed. Bolt on part to expect for this would be fmic and a better intake. Def must have tubo back exhaust also. These are estimate figures but yer ones to aim for thats for sure

Thank you for your reply.

So, what are the boost figures for this map? Is it 1.2 bar @ 6000 rpm? What is the ignition timing at that moment?

What does the boost curve look like, what is the peak, what is the boost at 5000 rpm, 6000?

At what rpm is max power reached?

I would love to get all the info available. Who did the tune?

Cheers,
Patrick

[Patrick]

In theory it could be enough with 1.2 bar to get approx. 230 flywheel hp.

This theory would include the Brabus cam timing though.

The figures for the Brabus:
177 hp (130 kW) @ 0.7 bar =
177/1.7 = 104 hp (76.5 kW) in n/a mode.

In theory @ 1.2 bar:
104 * 2.2 = 229 hp (168 kW).

What would the calculation look like based on your Colt?

Cheers,
Patrick
p.s. the relationship is naturally not linear like this.

[ommeh]

That kind of info i dont have as this was all done in Singapore.

www.ctfsg.com <-- here is best where you should ask where they've done almost everything you could possibily think of to the Rcolt with the 4G15 engine.



STOCK TF035
Requirements: Stock Setup
Suitabillity: MT/CVT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 1600-2200 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 2800-3200RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 3800-4000RPM
Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
Max BHP: 240-245

IHI RHF5
Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
Suitabillity: MT/CVT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 1800-2600 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3200-4200RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 4800-5000RPM
Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
Max BHP: 230-250

WRX TD04L
Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
Suitabillity: MT/CVT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 2000-2800 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3400-4400 RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): 5000-5200 RPM
Max Boost: 1.2 BAR
Max BHP: 270-280

IHI VF35
Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
Suitabillity: MT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3200-3500 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4400-4700RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
Max BHP: 290-350

IHI VF28
Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/Modified Stock Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/Modified Stock Downpipe
Suitabillity: MT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3500-3800 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4800-5000RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
Max BHP: 290-350

GARRETT GT2860RS
Requirements: DKC Turbo Header/HV Turbo Header + DKC Downpipe/HV Downpipe
Suitabillity: MT
Spool Start (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 3000-3400 RPM
Full Spool (Varies According to Transmission, Setup & Tuning): 4300-4700RPM
Out of Steam (According to Feedback): REDLINE
Max Boost: 1.5 BAR
Max BHP: 310-370

http://www.rcolt.com/showthread.php?t=2911

Here it is again. Link is above to that thread. Now the exact tune i'm not sure what they've done. Its hard to say as the tuners are all in Singapore and almost all these power figures and turbos where used in a Singapore Colt. Hope this helps in some way :)

[Patrick]

our car certainly isn't free-revving in any way but i suspect that's largely to do with the electronic throttle setup in the cars.

No, actually that is in the mapping. The smart, using the same throttle setup, is much more free reving.

I hope that you guys soon get a solution and can start remapping your Colts!

Here in Sweden we love products from Australia! The Autronic is probably what we love the most, but some people (like I) run (in an old Volvo 245T) and love Haltech.

:)
Patrick

[Patrick]

That kind of info i dont have as this was all done in Singapore.

www.ctfsg.com <-- here is best where you should ask where they've done almost everything you could possibily think of to the Rcolt with the 4G15 engine.

Thank you! I'll check it out.

Cheers,
Patrick

[ommeh]

No, actually that is in the mapping. The smart, using the same throttle setup, is much more free reving.

I hope that you guys soon get a solution and can start remapping your Colts!

Here in Sweden we love products from Australia! The Autronic is probably what we love the most, but some people (like I) run (in an old Volvo 245T) and love Haltech.

:)
Patrick

I was going to be the test car for Autronic but due to lack of time and funds i cant fork out the money to buy their system :(

[Patrick]

The easiest way to power is to go all out and change to an aftermarket EMS like Autronic. It seems that noone except for Brabus know exactly what is what in my ECU and they don't want to help me with a remap.

The reason why I don't go the Autronic SM4 way is that it would remove the functionality of my Comand, steering wheel buttons, and other stuff that are nice to have. I am simply too comfortable. ;)

[Nic85]

Anyone here in Australia can put a piggyback ECU on their RColt, it just seems like we're all too cheap. :p I had a Haltech Interceptor put on my old Ralliart Magna and there was no ECU tuning available for the Magna ECU at the time. It cost me about $1700 all wired in, installed, tuned and a new fuel filter.

[underdog]

I don't know mate, there could be a few reasons you won't get any help here though..

i. we don't have brabus forfours here and
ii. we really haven't been able to explore too much past an exhaust, intercooler & minor boost upgrades.

we'll be getting into ecu tuning shortly.

might be worth checking with other uk forums like www.cztoc.co.uk and coltclub.eu (you've probably already been there)

our car certainly isn't free-revving in any way but i suspect that's largely to do with the electronic throttle setup in the cars.

keep us posted on how you go though, any information about the 4g15 engine is good for us.

Gday mate, im sorry to say that youre wrong about the brabus, they are available here,not many but definitely, ive seen them on carsales[ a lot of smart vehicles] a bit pricey though :D

[filofaith]

i saw a forfour brabus at uni... but it cud be just a badge....

[alba]

Anyone here in Australia can put a piggyback ECU on their RColt, it just seems like we're all too cheap. :p I had a Haltech Interceptor put on my old Ralliart Magna and there was no ECU tuning available for the Magna ECU at the time. It cost me about $1700 all wired in, installed, tuned and a new fuel filter.

what were the gains like?

[Nic85]

what were the gains like?

Well, keeping in mind Magnas already have a good exhaust system and headers, I gained around 20hp at the wheels with extractors, exhaust and the haltech. The biggest improvement was mid range torque, it transformed the car. Also the economy was a lot better as the tuner pulled a lot of fuel out between 3000-5000rpm.

[ommeh]

Its not really about being cheap. Its more on the lines of no one wants to go 1st. Remember its VOID warranty and if your engine blows well... badluck

[alba]

Its not really about being cheap. Its more on the lines of no one wants to go 1st. Remember its VOID warranty and if your engine blows well... badluck

its also a big step from what we can do now
with car modding, very rarely does someone go all out on a brand new car straightaway

its always...
exhaust + filter, drive around for a while, want something faster
fiddle with boost, drive around for a bit longer, decide its not enough
FMIC + more boost, drive around for a while, want more driveability
etc

plus nobody wants to fork out over $2k with no idea how much return they are going to get in terms of HP

[ommeh]

Thats correct. Personally I dont plan on forking out $2000 on a tune that might only give me 20hp or something. Again it will be one of the last things i would consider before getting more parts for the car.

[filofaith]

hows a piggyback going work without spending BIG $$$$$$?? i think RPW already established that a piggyback will not work with the Rcolt... only a standalone unit, this is why where doing a reflash and the haltech was CANNED

[Payload]

I think they actually got a piggyback kinda working ok, dont know how wel it was working but there is some details on their website in the customer vehicles section. Its like the last section for the R&D rcolt. Says that AFR tuning only was getting around 20-30kw atw improvements.

Link for anyone interested http://www.rpw.com.au/shop/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=200&Itemid=40

[filofaith]

I think they actually got a piggyback kinda working ok, dont know how wel it was working but there is some details on their website in the customer vehicles section. Its like the last section for the R&D rcolt. Says that AFR tuning only was getting around 20-30kw atw improvements.

Link for anyone interested http://www.rpw.com.au/shop/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=200&Itemid=40

on the thread it says it was working on the dyno but not in real life condition with different loads on the motor....

[ommeh]

hows a piggyback going work without spending BIG $$$$$$?? i think RPW already established that a piggyback will not work with the Rcolt... only a standalone unit, this is why where doing a reflash and the haltech was CANNED

Then how do you explain the rcolts in Singapore using Unichip? That is a piggyback...


Getting rid of these safety function can only be done by removing our ECU and going fully standalone. However, this is not possible as to do that, we need to remove our e-throttle and go for cable throttle. There are ECUs out there capable of controlling e-throttles but again, these ECUs are not able to be installed on our rides for the time being.

Good luck with stand alone. To get the stand alone to work you would be forking out a CRAP tonne more then what you would to get the piggyback to work.

[filofaith]

Then how do you explain the rcolts in Singapore using Unichip? That is a piggyback...



Good luck with stand alone. To get the stand alone to work you would be forking out a CRAP tonne more then what you would to get the piggyback to work.

lol ommeh i thought ud know the answer to that question its been discuss far too many times that SINGAPORE HAVE THE JDM colt we have the ADM colt running different ecu's and sensor's if you think im wrong then talk to RPW that actually tried to crack the ECU with a piggyback and failed... yes stand-a-lone would cost and arm but it will work, piggyback will not without weeks and weeks of trial and error which will have labor/tuning costs that are more then the cost of a stand-alone

[ommeh]

lol ommeh i thought ud know the answer to that question its been discuss far too many times that SINGAPORE HAVE THE JDM colt we have the ADM colt running different ecu's and sensor's if you think im wrong then talk to RPW that actually tried to crack the ECU with a piggyback and failed... yes stand-a-lone would cost and arm but it will work, piggyback will not without weeks and weeks of trial and error which will have labor/tuning costs that are more then the cost of a stand-alone

I was unaware of this :S

Always thought the ECU's where the same lol. That time away and i missed so much lol~

[Nic85]

lol ommeh i thought ud know the answer to that question its been discuss far too many times that SINGAPORE HAVE THE JDM colt we have the ADM colt running different ecu's and sensor's if you think im wrong then talk to RPW that actually tried to crack the ECU with a piggyback and failed... yes stand-a-lone would cost and arm but it will work, piggyback will not without weeks and weeks of trial and error which will have labor/tuning costs that are more then the cost of a stand-alone

A piggyback should work. There's no "cracking" of the ECU needed with a piggyback. All a piggyback ECU does is intercept the signal from the crank angle sensor and adjusts the AFR and timing, you could use an electronic boost controller for the boost. I'm not saying it's the best solution, or even one we should be looking at.


Thats correct. Personally I dont plan on forking out $2000 on a tune that might only give me 20hp or something. Again it will be one of the last things i would consider before getting more parts for the car.

This type of thing I don't understand. In a turbo car where boost stability and AFR's are SO important, there should be a tune done with each and every mod. Especially an exhaust. It is very important to not run too rich or you can do damage to piston rings and the bores. Too lean and you can melt pistons and crack the crowns off them, throw rods etc.

It would be really worth some more work on the piggyback option I believe. I know the standard ECU will be cracked sooner or later, but what is the pricing going to be like? And what about when you need another tune for your standard ECU once you do more modifications? Another $1000? :confused:

[ommeh]

I would be more inclined to tune suspension and brakes thnx. Dont think mods are just all power. Being fast is not just about how much power you make. Also i think it would be smart to get your parts say fmic intake upgrade and exhaust before a tune. Why bother tuning stock parts?? You will waste the tune as soon as you change something. You consider that?

[Nic85]

I would be more inclined to tune suspension and brakes thnx. Dont think mods are just all power. Being fast is not just about how much power you make. Also i think it would be smart to get your parts say fmic intake upgrade and exhaust before a tune. Why bother tuning stock parts?? You will waste the tune as soon as you change something. You consider that?

Ok, I don't really know what you're on about mate... I didn't say anything about brakes or suspension or being fast. :confused: I completely agree tho! Altho I think the RColt brakes are more than adequate, even for upgraded power levels.

I also didn't say anything about tuning stock parts. I talked about tuning once modifications were done. I said it's very important. You could tune a stock car if you want - I'm sure there would be some gains in leaning out the fuel mixture and possibly advancing the timing a bit, but nowhere near as much as doing exhaust, intake etc.

[Macca]

With the piggyback the haltac issue was based on the stock ecu and the torque check systems no piggyback van avoid that cel. A flash willbe required first.

[filofaith]

A piggyback should work. There's no "cracking" of the ECU needed with a piggyback. All a piggyback ECU does is intercept the signal from the crank angle sensor and adjusts the AFR and timing, you could use an electronic boost controller for the boost. I'm not saying it's the best solution, or even one we should be looking at.


well everything you have just mentioned was trialed by RPW and all has come back in the end as a failed attempt due to the complexity of the AUS ecu if piggyback was an option my car would already have one, i dont sit there saying things should work i go out and do it, to help the rcolt community nearly all my modifications were made before any real tests were completed or kits were available... however im not game to go standalone as the benefits dont out weigh the costs

[Nic85]

well everything you have just mentioned was trialed by RPW and all has come back in the end as a failed attempt due to the complexity of the AUS ecu if piggyback was an option my car would already have one, i dont sit there saying things should work i go out and do it, to help the rcolt community nearly all my modifications were made before any real tests were completed or kits were available... however im not game to go standalone as the benefits dont out weigh the costs

RPW tried it and failed so it's impossible. Ok. I don't believe it is, but that's just my opinion.

[ommeh]

This type of thing I don't understand. In a turbo car where boost stability and AFR's are SO important, there should be a tune done with each and every mod. Especially an exhaust. It is very important to not run too rich or you can do damage to piston rings and the bores. Too lean and you can melt pistons and crack the crowns off them, throw rods etc.


Shall rephrase. What i meant was that it being my last mod (I would do other mods such as suspension etc etc etc) because a tune is needed to extract that power everyone wants. Now this is when a scangauge and a A/F meter comes into play and after all my mods everything runs normal. Hence why it would be a final mod once all the bolt on parts are installed. ECU's can adjust to new mods and from everyone who has a FMIC and turbo back exhaust etc etc have had no issues. There is no real danger running rich. Running lean is when problems happen. Turbo cars are factory tuned to run rich on purpose to protect the engine. Running rich is a car's way to protect itself. When my heater core sprung a crack and coolant was leaking out the car started to overheat. To compensate for this the ECU pumped HUGE amounts of fuel into the engine to force it to run very rich to prevent any more damage. It was causing more fuel to be wasted but also help cool the engine temp down as much as possible. I drove for 10mins just so i could get home when i noticed the car was over heating and i used literrally 1/2 tank of fuel. I watched the needle drop every min i drove (didnt go over 2,500rpm). But i understand your point but cars can handle the odd change here and there. Its best to tune it after most of your bolt on parts are changed. Ofcourse changing a turbo without tune is stupid but what i am saying is FMIC -> Turboback Exhaust -> Larger intake -> ECU Tune. It should be around here when the tune is needed. Hope i made some sense lol~

[Patrick]

www.ctfsg.com <-- here is best where you should ask where they've done almost everything you could possibily think of to the Rcolt with the 4G15 engine.

I have to say that it is not easy at all getting in there...

[ommeh]

It is kinda exclusive site~~

Tooke me a good 2weeks to get joined up~

[filofaith]

same over night membership ;)

[ommeh]

Sometimes it takes longer. As the admin need to review your application.

[bpt4w]

does anyone have any japanese friends who might be able to look and see if they have cracked the ECU ?

[bpt4w]

oh by the way did we ever work out the sizing of the turbo the thread sort of took on a life of its own.

[filofaith]

does anyone have any japanese friends who might be able to look and see if they have cracked the ECU ?

different ecu to us and yes they can tune...


oh by the way did we ever work out the sizing of the turbo the thread sort of took on a life of its own.

TF035 is our standard turbo

[daedalusjc]

turbo sizing in respect to what? So far i've tested the turbo to hold boost in 3rd at rev limiter to be 1.3 bar. Our turbo's pretty well sized