Motor Mag Bang for your buck

[putty_sydney]

Does anyone have a copy of motor magazine that had the bang for your buck withe colt being the winner? Are you able to scan and post it or email/ftp it?

Has anyone else seen a printed magazine article on the rcolt that can be scanned?

[lovecolt]

Do you mean last yrs' BFYB article or the coming one?

[putty_sydney]

I believe last years, I think it was about August.

[lovecolt]

I believe last years, I think it was about August.

Might have to see where i put it. But me have no scanner.......maybe just take a high res pic....

[Rdster]

I've got the article in question.

I can scan it and post it on line over the weekend.

[DAC]

Cool... I haven't read that one so I'd be keen to hear what Motor says about the rcolt

[putty_sydney]

That would be awesome if you can post it. let me know if you need an FTP site to upload it to, I can give you the details of mine.

[Rdster]

Here it is.

If you recalculate the scores, and factor in that some people are buying the RC at $25990 driveaway,it would have won BFYB easily!

[putty_sydney]

Rdster thats great. Thank you very much

[DAC]

Thanks Rdster. Good to know :)

[bomber]

The 2007 Bang For Your Buck is out in the next Motor Magazine due 8th of August.
I believe the rules for eligibility for Bang For your Buck is any new model or a model that has been had a significant update and any overall and catergory winners from the previous year.
Despite the Colt not being updated in the last 12 months (apart from them removing the sunglasses holder), that means it should be eligible.
What's it's chances of a repeat?
I drove the XR4 the other day and reckon it'll give the Colt a big run for it's money. Afterall, they go on rrp and the Fiesta is $5,000 cheaper than the colt.

[lovecolt]

I hope the RColt will be in the BFYB again.

No doubt XR4's pretty good, but as i always said its pricing isn't any better than a RColt. What's the cost of having a extra 2 dr, proper racing seats, bigger interior....etc. If you factor these in a xr4, you will most likely find the both of them are around the same price.

[Macca]

i test drove the xr4, the colts got more power, and better traction system.

the xr4 had half leather seats

i would rather turbo!

and ralli art is just plain sex on wheels

[Jusnippinout]

I would put my money on the XR4, not because it's a better car, but because the Aussie motor mags always favour Holden or Ford, which are perceived to be a domestic product, irrespective of whether they are imported or made here. You only have to look at the front covers to see the staggering bias - despite there being hundreds of cars on the market, the Commodore or Falcon almost always steal the cover story :mad:

The Commodore or Falcon doesn't always win (that would be too obvious) but they are grossly over represented in both the editorial and winners of tests and reviews. So the new Commodore is as good as a 5 Series BMW? Give me a break!

The motor sport mags are even worse, devoting 50% of their pages to Commodores and Falcons, in their seemingly endless variations: Supercars, more Supercars, Utes, V8 Giants, Commodore Cup, etc etc. zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Even one of my favourite categories (known as 'Legends' in most countries but 'Aussie Racers here :rolleyes: ) wear replica Commodore and Falcon bodies.

Enough already!

[DAC]

Don't discount the XR4 too quickly. It doesn't have a turbo but its no slug when you put your foot to the floor. Plus its a few thousand cheaper to buy than the rcolt at rrp so it'll get extra points for that...

[bomber]

Don't be too quick to think that the whole system is biased.
I think the Motor Bang For Your Buck has been pretty well done in the past, especially when it comes to thinking outside the square.
Remember that the Renault Clio Sport won the Bang For Your Buck award outright upon release and continued to win it's catergory for the next two years until it was discontinued.
I agree about the covers though, but it's just a matter of what sells. I remember someone complaining to one of the 4 cylinder modification magazines that there was too many WRX covers and the magazine responded by saying that unfortunately, they always sold a lot more issues when there was a WRX on the cover. Ditto a Commodore or Falcon on the cover of Motor.
I'm certainly not defending the archaic Falcon and Commodore, but their marketing to what the public wants. This is why basically every issue basically features some sort of Holden Vs Ford rivalry. Move on, please.
And by the way, the XR4 is an excellent car and reminds me very much of the Clio Sport. It's immensely fun to drive. Granted, it doesn't have the turbo rush of the Colt, but it's handling couldn't be matched by the Colt. I guess that's a byproduct of 2 doors and a lower rooftline.
Anyway, the debate for Colt Vs (input car here) will go on in the forum, the danger is becoming biased towards any vehicle and not looking at what else is out there objectively.

[Macca]

i thought the handling and brakes were better on the colt, but the xr4 was impressive, the engine in a pug gti was more impressive, but the pug is too french, and strange, and the engine has soooooooooo much torque shift, i could feel it swaying about under the hood like it has a broken engine mount.

[bomber]

New Motor is out today!

Hopefully the Colt makes an appearance again!

[27AME]

I haven't driven the XR4 so I won't make a judgement on which will win out of the two.

However, the Colt will HAVE to maul the Polo GTi this year, especially after the colt has dropped about $5K and the Polo has GONE UP (Now listed for 29,990 again I believe). IMO, the Polo can no longer compete, lets just get the Ralliart name and the Colt name out there and get the two associated with each other and I think we could have a lot more people jumping into them.

However, I don't mind the XR4, seems like a great idea. Definitely dominates the category that the Swift Sport is placed in!

[aby82]

i'm pretty sure the rcolt won't be making an appearance cause i dont think it wasn't mentioned last issue as being in the short list.. but dont attack me if i'm wrong! :D

[bomber]

I don't know if the rules have changed, but the dilemma with BFYB is that it's based on RRP. It doesn't matter if dealers are discounting or increasing their prices, it's based off the RRP. RRP for the Colt is still $29,990. It's just most dealers are offering it $5,000 cheaper.
If you compared a $26,000 drive away Colt to a $25,000+ORC XR4, the Colt would be very competitive.

[27AME]

I don't know if the rules have changed, but the dilemma with BFYB is that it's based on RRP. It doesn't matter if dealers are discounting or increasing their prices, it's based off the RRP. RRP for the Colt is still $29,990. It's just most dealers are offering it $5,000 cheaper.
If you compared a $26,000 drive away Colt to a $25,000+ORC XR4, the Colt would be very competitive.

That's very true, but I do believe the Polo GTi has been officially reset at 29,990 RRP.. So yeah, the Colt mauls it :)

[lovecolt]

Just went to the news agency and found no new Motor Mag with the BFYB.



However, the Colt will HAVE to maul the Polo GTi this year, especially after the colt has dropped about $5K and the Polo has GONE UP (Now listed for 29,990 again I believe). IMO, the Polo can no longer compete, lets just get the Ralliart name and the Colt name out there and get the two associated with each other and I think we could have a lot more people jumping into them.


I think we have to make it clear that the $5k drop is only a temp thing as Ralliart just want to boost the number of RColt on the road to make on road presence. This is advised by Steve Bell (Ralliart manager) Once all the 06 models are cleared, it will be back to usual pricing again.

[bomber]

Yeah I know. That sucks. Newsagency here doesn't have it either. They've got the last issue though where the last page says the next issue featuring 2008 BFYB is out Wednesday August 8.
Thought it might be the usual 'WA' delays. Anyone out there see the result?

[27AME]

Just went to the news agency and found no new Motor Mag with the BFYB.



I think we have to make it clear that the $5k drop is only a temp thing as Ralliart just want to boost the number of RColt on the road to make on road presence. This is advised by Steve Bell (Ralliart manager) Once all the 06 models are cleared, it will be back to usual pricing again.

The fact that they still have 06 models shows how dismal sales were :p

[shaneth]

That's very true, but I do believe the Polo GTi has been officially reset at 29,990 RRP.. So yeah, the Colt mauls it :)

Where did you hear this as the website still says 26,990rrp.
Polo Price list (http://www.volkswagen.com.au/pdf/price_List/Volkswagen%20Polo%20Price%20List%20March%202007.pd f)

[27AME]

Where did you hear this as the website still says 26,990rrp.
Polo Price list (http://www.volkswagen.com.au/pdf/price_List/Volkswagen%20Polo%20Price%20List%20March%202007.pd f)

Kai told me (I think you know him - fellow GTi owner). I also saw it in the paper aswell!

[aby82]

$29990 is probly the drive away price..

[lovecolt]

The issue is out and we are the 3th out of the 4 contenders :( Lose over XR4 and Swift Sport...... Haven't gone through the magazines yet, as i only saw a small pdf section off fordxr4.com. Must get it tommorrow :mad:

[lovecolt]

Still can't find the mag till today. According from the description off the pdf posted in fordxr4.com and our car do 1:15 flat at wakefield (1st) and XR4 is 1:15.5ish (2nd). Hopefully i didn't get it wrong :p But 1 min 15 secs for a stockie is pretty damn impressive. Looks like Mitsubishi is right after all when they first announce that the RColt is only 2 sec slower than a Evo 9. Evo 9 do around 1:12 stock at wakefield.

Has anyone got a copy of the mag yet?

[Steve-B]

you sure you have the right mag, i have the motor mag here on the desk for the aug release, it has a polo gti, type r civic and mazda mps...the new camaro and some holden and ford battle...no BFYB....???

[bomber]

Yeah, it's this month's Motor.
As with all magazine's, they publish the month as being one in advance. The BFYB issue is September's Issue, even though it was due out on the 8th of August.
I spoke to two newsagents and their shipments have been delayed. I still haven't seen the full issue yet, I've just read the write up on the XR4 and the overall catergory scores for sub $30K.
If you want to check it out, it's on the XR4 forum.

http://www.fordxr4.com/forum/index.php?topic=13.msg1140#msg1140

[|2colt]

Its true we finish a =( third but we finish 1st 0-100, 0-400m, 80kms-120kms and lap time. Last in braking lol and last in apex speed. This just shows that we have the speed right but need to get our suspension setup upgraded.

[lovecolt]

We got last in braking?? Serious?? that must be a worn down RColt they used :p Because the test done by Best Motoring in Jap comfirmed that RColt has at least 1/3 better braking power than a Swift Sport.

But having said that, i'm still happy with the result as the only thing i care about in the test, is the laptime. Quoting the famous line off Fast & Furious, "It doesn't matter if its a inch or a second, winning is winning" :D In this case, i don't care how good you corner or you brake, winning is winning :D

[bomber]

Finally, Motor has hit the WA stands.
Geez, the caned the Colt too - including Warren Luff giving the Colt a thumbs down in the photo!
After the favourable review it got in last year's BFYB, I'm surprised the general mood was noticably different this year - especially considering there's been no major changes made.

[lovecolt]

This is what's written



Word to word from their article:
The Colt's Biggest problem is not that its incapable of delivering a decent bang; rather that the idea of a small performance bus leaves us a bit cold. See, the underpinnings might be Ralliarted, but the basic bodyshell remains. Even from inside, the side windows in front of the door suggest a people-mover layout and, frankly, its just not sexy.

That aside, the Colt is abit of a belter, particularly under the bonnet. It has easily the fattest motor of the tiddlers, with a big spread of power and torque.

That's borne out by the Colt's speed among the little-uns; a 0-100km/h time of 7.8 blitzes the Suzuki, Fiat and Ford. Same thing holds for the 400m dash, with the Colt clocking a credible 16-dead. A Wakefield lap time of 75.12 put the sub-$30k Mitsu ahead of give other cars and it would have been even faster with a bit more grip.

The front end, in particular, can feel loose, with the Colt steering like its on skinny front hoops (which it ain't). Its not all that throttle-steerable (not as much as the Suzuki, anyway) and its not as much fun as the Swift, either.

The gearshift doesn't help by being typically cable-notchy, but at least the seats are the biz, holding you in place well, despite the higher-than-we'd-like seating position. But that's, really, just another factor of the Ralliart being a hotted-up little mumsy bus.


Quickest because of its power, not its chassis. Lots of mid-to-exit understeer once the turbo kicks in so you have to get off the throttle to stop it washing away. There's also pitch under braking and you sit too high, but if you could put this engine in the Fiesta you'd have a great hot hatch

[lovecolt]

I'm pretty disappointed with the journalist that written the comment.

I mean, come on...making the judgement based on the looks more than its performance. And they are really off the pace this year. They done the 0 - 100kmph in 7.4 secs and 0-400 in 15.3 sec last year. So, they said its only a hotted up little mumsy bus......then its a mumsy bus that beat all the other "MAN" car :D

[Raymond6]

It's great for us to post what is said and so on;
Why not sit down and tear apart Motor Magazines conclusions with facts and write a reply to their story and send it to them one thing that could be said is in an same spec colt you tested last year you achived a 0-100kmph sprint in what was it 7.1 seconds and if you check out the folllowing website the braking distance for the colt is X which kills the swift by 33% and so on use their testing and figures against them. Then Quote facts from other reprable tests and find out from Steve Why the hell the brakes on the Rcolt they tested were so Stuffed and if the suspension was all shagged out from prevoius test like had it been used as a press car?
Get Steve to offer them a carfully run in Rcolt then lets see what the results are???? and Motors reply to Facts!

[|2colt]

I think they have sold out to ford....lol.... put in a good article about the xr4 and made the other hatches seems like crap. Not saying that the Xr4 isnt any good but the change in opinion from last year which motor said that the R Colt was a car that could compete with cars above it weight class compared to this years comments of being a mumsy mini bus.

Sound like a good idea Raymond.

[lovecolt]

Here's the result of RColt:
0-100km/h: 7.8 secs
0-400m: 16 sec @ 141.5km/h
0-1000m: 29.4 sec @177.1 km/h
80-120 km/h (3rd gear): 5.5 secs
100 km/h - 0: 39.1 m
Laptime: 1:15.12 sec @ 154.77 km/h
Apex Speed: 79.43 km/h

Here's the result of Swift Sport:
0-100km/h: 9.7 secs
0-400m: 17.1 sec @ 131.9km/h
0-1000m: 31.4 sec @167 km/h
80-120 km/h (3rd gear): 7.1 secs
100 km/h - 0: 38.4 m
Laptime: 1:17.29 sec @ 145.38 km/h
Apex Speed: 82.99 km/h

Here's the result of XR4:
0-100km/h: 9 secs
0-400m: 16.3 sec @ 139.3km/h
0-1000m: 29.8 sec @ 175.5 km/h
80-120 km/h (3rd gear): 6 secs
100 km/h - 0: 37 m
Laptime: 1:15.51 sec @ 152.96 km/h
Apex Speed: 81.51 km/h

[lovecolt]

I agree the comment about selling out to Ford (our opinion). In the XR4's stats, they written it weights 1090 kg with 110 kw and yet the power-weight ratio is 110 kw/tonne. Either they fail their maths or our opinion are correct.

Have anyone realised that all track pics from the mag for XR4, are in the same style where it makes XR4 always look like its drifting??

[Jusnippinout]

I would put my money on the XR4, not because it's a better car, but because the Aussie motor mags always favour Holden or Ford, which are perceived to be a domestic product, irrespective of whether they are imported or made here. You only have to look at the front covers to see the staggering bias - despite there being hundreds of cars on the market, the Commodore or Falcon almost always steal the cover story :mad:......

I don't want to say "I Told You So" but......

I told you so! ;)

However, I would agree with the comments about understeer. My RColt has much less mid-corner grip at the front than it should have, given the top quality rubber and stiff rear sway bar. Something is definitely not optimised at the front.

[lovecolt]

But our rcolt don't have a rear sway bar at all? Unless you considered a torsion beam a form of barring....which is true to a certain extent.

Actually, i'm not surprised too as its BYFB plus XR4 cost 5k lesser and performed almost the same. But what i'm surprised is just the standard of wordings used or opinions are more like from a 15 yr old kid than a professional journalist.

[radiostar69]

Does the result surprise you? Who has the biggest advertising budget, which car company do you see almost every ad break during peak times? Like a lot of car magazines, if a major car company has some major advertising dollars with the magazine they aint gonna bag it...regardless of what they think. Its the same in radio, tv and Newspapers...not exactly legal, but most wont know the difference!

[bomber]

I think they have sold out to ford....lol.... put in a good article about the xr4 and made the other hatches seems like crap. Not saying that the Xr4 isnt any good but the change in opinion from last year which motor said that the R Colt was a car that could compete with cars above it weight class compared to this years comments of being a mumsy mini bus.

Sound like a good idea Raymond.

I don't think they've sold out to Ford. The SS won the BFYB overall and the Evo was a unanimous victor in it's catergory as all the judges voted it number 1. It's just this year, person opinions counted for only 5% of the overall score. If this was a higher percentage a MITSUBISHI would have won the catergory and overall.
Plus, they were glowing in the review of the Swift Sport including Luff saying he really enjoyed it.
Not saying anything about the Colt Vs Swift Vs XR4 argument, but there comments and the spread of votes between makes looked objective.

[bomber]

Does the result surprise you? Who has the biggest advertising budget, which car company do you see almost every ad break during peak times? Like a lot of car magazines, if a major car company has some major advertising dollars with the magazine they aint gonna bag it...regardless of what they think. Its the same in radio, tv and Newspapers...not exactly legal, but most wont know the difference!

Also, in regard to the companies with the biggest advertising budgets and the fact MOTOR may have sold out - look at the review of the FORD FPV Force 6 in the $65k-$80k catergory. The Nissan 350Z took out the catergrory with all but one voting it number 1.

Sounds like people are making comments without reading the article, except for the couple of pages attached above.

The comments of the FPV Force 6 were "It's certainly got plenty of power, but feels lazy in the corners. It needs to be stiffer to be able to carry more speed. And being an auto, the gearing's really bad; it looses a lot of time. The engine's it's strong point and the brakes are good, but the rear slips away under power."

Out of 6, the judges voted it: 4th, 5th, 6th, 4th and 6th. Hardly the 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st and 1st you'd expect if they were truly manufacturer biased.

I'm not defending MOTOR, but read the article, they certainly weren't biased to one make. Again, the Evo was the car the reviewers liked overall.

[lovecolt]

Concurred Bomber.

I think its really the anger we got after reading such a unconvincing opinion on our rcolt. For other makes, because we don't own them, hence we don't know the true story and no suitable comment is avaliable.

Also, the journalist's comment is really out of the line for the original BFYB intention. Things like looks shouldn't even be part of the competition. Nor personally opinion (5% of the marks) as different people prefers different things. Its a BFYB and not Looks For Your Buck or Personal Liking For Your Buck.

[|2colt]

Im not saying that the XR4 is a shit box. On paper it looks like a really good package. I guess im a bit disturbed by the journalistic comments and how they display the stats. For instance the RColt canes the Swift in every area besides the apex and braking. We finish 1st in all others. The swift fails dismally with the other five areas either finishing 4th or 3rd. As an average Joe i would look at that result and put the Colt above the Swift. The Xr4 on the result did deserve 1st place because it was alwasy in the top 2 in all areas.

Ps im not taking a Stab at the Swift either lol. Good car not enough power.

[Jusnippinout]

I couldn't disagree more about lack of bias. The evidence is plain to see. Given the sheer number of manufacturers out there, it seems odd that two manufacturers (Ford and Holden) consistently score well in the results of comparos. Statistically at least, this is very dodgy.

Every new Commodore or Falcon gets rave reviews. It's only some months later, when buyers have had a chance to 'review' the cars themselves, that the mags begin to point out the odd flaw...........

Also: the stiff sway bar I mentioned may be incorrect (I haven't looked at the suspension to be honest) but something in the design of the RColt's rear suspension has the same effect - very stiff rebound damping maybe? Even fairly moderate cornering has the inside rear wheel off the ground quite early, as would happen with a stiff sway (anti roll) bar. That the RColt understeers in spite of this is remarkable.

Stiff rear sway bars are usually employed to reduce understeer and are a common feature on racing minis. Lifting the inside wheel reduces grip and thus introduces mild oversteer to balance the handling. Whatever the cause, I agree with the tester than there is less front grip than you might expect. It's always a dilemma for manufacturers - understeer is a safer proposition for everyday drivers, but dial in too much and you compromise overall grip.

[bomber]

Just another note about the full BFYB article.
Yes, the Swift bet the Colt.
However, the overall points for the Swift was 162.5 against the Colt, which was 159.8.
I can't figure the calculations out, but this is how it shaped up:

Bang Index Bucks Bucks Index BFYB Index
Fiesta XR4 189.0 $24,990 59.9 180.2
Swift Sport 196.9 $23,990 30.9 162.5
Colt Ralliart 157.5 $29,990 62.0 159.8

I can't see how it works because the Bang Index for the Colt is extremely low. I can't see how it makes the ground up when it's a more expensive car and the XR4 and Swift both have a higher bang index. I would've thought a lower bang index and a high price would've sent the overall BFYB Index down further, but instead in makes up ground on the XR4 and Swift.
When you are talking about BANG for your BUCKS. Surely, you want more BANG for less BUCKS. Not less BANG for more BUCKS.

Anyway, I assume there's some validity to the math that I just don't understand. Anyway, with the Colt being only 2.7 behind the Swift, I would have thought dropping the price of the Colt to $24,990 or maybe less (considering the $26k drive away price most people are finding) would improve the score substantially. Say using a price of $25,000 - this is a discount of 16.64% off the $29,990 rrp.
Considering the margin between the Swift and Colt is only 1.66%, I would think this should see the Colt pass the Swift for number 2 spot. Don't think it'd catch the XR4 though.

[Macca]

It a shame cause IRL you can get the colt cheaper than both atm. but saying that, price will go up.

Our cars do have alot more electronics in them too, engine wise.

[aby82]

yep well it is BANG for your BUCKS and the rcolts RRP is just too high compared to the others in this category..

btw where was the polo gti this year??? - still sulking after colts victory last year ;)

[lovecolt]

I was thinking of that too. I guess Polo GTI just don't have the edge to compete. It doesn't corner as good as xr4 and don't go as quick as RColt. But you have to admit, its the most luxury of all.

[bomber]

The Polo GTi was omitted because only new models, models that have had an update (like the Swift Sport) or catergory winners from the previous year can be considered for BFYB. That's why the Colt was included. The Swift received ESP this year, so it was included and the Fiat Punto and XR4 are both new models.

[aby82]

ok cheers for that bomber - makes sense..

but about the swift sport, it wasn't out at the time of last years bang for your buck, so regardless of the ESP upgrade its considered a new model..

[DAC]

Just quickly flicked through BFYB. Surprisingly the rcolt got hammered this year. It even got a thumbs down :confused:

Last year Luff said "Brakes and gearbox are quiet good..." but that's not what he said about it this year. Seems like a bit of a contradiction here? Only other reason could be that they used a worn out rcolt for their testing.

Anyway I'll still be keeping mine regardless of what BFYB reports. Flick over a few more pages and I'm even more surprised. The new Civic Type R is last in its category :eek: Need I say more...

[27AME]

To be honest the Type R looked like it deserved to be at the bottom of its category...

[DAC]

I've not driven one yet but according to the Stig from Top gear he rates it number 1 out of all the current hot hatches in the UK.

It seems to rate very well in most of the reviews I have read about it so in BFYB I would have expected it to come nearer to the top then dead last...

[27AME]

The BFYB was all about performance. It's too heavy, slow and aesthetically its very unpleasing (although this didn't have much influence on outcomes). The drivers in the BFYB hated it and coming in at under 200nM I don't blame them. The Colt only just has enough response with a turbo and 210nM, would hate to feel the sluggishness of the Type R. Torque > HP IMO.

[bomber]

I must admit, BFYB was weird this year. I understand the premise, but I just found it strange when the judges vote for an unanimous winner for a category (The Evo) and yet it is beat by a car that rated 3rds and 4th for the category.Especially when the price spread is not really that wide.
I used to like BFYB as it really gave a good idea of some places that your money could be better spent. Like when the Clio Sport took out the award.
The math and the judges votes being out of whack with the actual winners just seemed strange to me.
I guess the award is now becoming purely analytical. By the numbers, what provides you the most bang for your buck. It could be a dog to drive, have a crappy interior and electronics, but could still win on outright speed.

[Miyagi]

Don't be surprised by the Motor journo's changing their opinions with the weather... they always have and always will. The human factor whilst apparently not measured in the BFYB index it does certainly play a factor in the write ups.

I think you need to factor in that the RColt simply isn't new and shiny like the Swift or in particular the XR4 and that does way heavily on journos minds (even though it shouldn't).

Motor and Wheels' figures have always seem to fluctuate and you'll find that sometimes they just don't *get* the best bits about a specific car and why people would buy them.

Cheers,
Miyagi

:cool:

[ColtArt]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkIKjFTa2kk

i dont get it

the ST (XR4) Vs a CZT (lesser spec colt) and they say its only .3 second slower then the XR4. the ralliart colt has better suspension, tyres and more power then the CZT. thats gotta make up .3 seconds

watching hte video, you can tell this guy CAN drive

[lovecolt]

That's why RColt win XR4 by 0.3 secs on the wakefield track in the Bang For Your Buck ;)

[Corosith]

Considering Motor magazine announced that BFYB this year was to be oriented more towards track prowess rather than road performance, I think the new formula backfired terribly. This is aimed squarely at people who want a car that can double as a weekend track car - how could the SS commodore win when it handled terrible, had a crap gearbox, and more dangerously, would run out of brakes after one good stomp netherlone after a few laps??? What use is that if you are going to be waiting trackside every second lap to wait for the brakes to cool down!:confused:

Vehicle performance should be measured as an overall package, not which car has the fastest 1/4 mile, or 0-100. I'd rather have decent brakes and suspension setup over vast amounts of power anyday.

I think the colt would have fared better as others have mentioned if the current price was taken into account - guess you can't please everybody!:)

[Macca]

Vehicle performance should be measured as an overall package, not which car has the fastest 1/4 mile, or 0-100. I'd rather have decent brakes and suspension setup over vast amounts of power anyday.


Very very ture, and quite prove-able, look at top gears lap times list ;)

also the reason why we all bought R colts ;)